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  From:  Blood_Bought (RFI1965)   7/10/2001 1:24 am  
To:  ALL   (1 of 31)  
 
  114.1  
 
If all Mormons are Christians,then all Christians are Mormon... 
Mormons claim to be Christian yet deny the essentials of Christianity; namely, that there is one God, that forgiveness of sins is by grace alone, that there is a trinity, that Jesus is God, etc. 
Mormonism teaches that there are many many gods but they serve and worship only one. It teaches that forgiveness of sins is not by grace alone. It denies the Trinity doctrine which says there is one God in three persons and says that there are three separate gods. It does not proclaim that Jesus is God, but that Jesus is "a" god.... etc. Additionally, Mormons have secret temple rituals, even though the temples have been done away with. 
Now, Mormons deny these basic Christian doctrines, yet they want to be called Christian because they say they believe in the same Jesus of the Bible, among other things. But when they speak of Jesus, they mean that Jesus is the brother of Satan, and you and I. They teach that we have all been born from god and his goddess wife who both have physical bodies of flesh and bones. 
None of this is in the Bible and none of this is believed by Christians. But that has not stopped them from wanting to be called Christian. 
So, since the Mormons deny basic Christian doctrine and claim to be Christian, then I can deny basic Mormon doctrine and be a Mormon. For example, I deny the following Mormon doctrines. 

I deny that there are many many gods (Mormon Doctrine, by Bruce McConkie, page 163). 
I deny that the trinity is three separate gods (Teachings of Prophet Joseph Smith page 370). 
I deny that god is a man from another planet (Journal of Discourses, Vol. 6, page 3). 
I deny that there is a goddess mother (Articles of Faith, by James Talmage, page 443). 
I deny that god is married to his goddess wife (Mormon Doctrine p. 516.). 
I deny that god and his goddess wife have bodies of flesh and bones (Doctrine and Covenants, 130:22; Joseph Smith, Journal of Discourses, Vol. 6, p. 3.) 
I deny that we were all born in the pre-existence (Journal of Discourse, Vol. 4, page 218; Articles of Faith, page 174). 
I deny that Satan is my spirit brother (Mormon Doctrine, page 163). 
I deny that I need a temple (Articles of Faith, page 138). 
I deny that I have the potential of becoming a god (Articles of Faith, page 424). 
I deny that the book of Mormon is more correct than the Bible (History of the Church, 4:461). 
I deny that good works are necessary for salvation (Articles of Faith, pages 81, 92). 
I deny that my own blood must atone for any of my sins ((Journal of Discourses, Vol. 3, page 247; see also, Vol. 4, pp. 53-54, 219-220). 

Therefore, since the Mormons deny basic Christian doctrines and call them selves Christian, is it okay for me to deny basic Mormon doctrines and call myself a Mormon? 

www.carm.org 
Copyright by Matthew J. Slick, 1998



In the name of Yeshua haMashiach,
God bless you,
Russ



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  From:  Blood_Bought (RFI1965)   7/10/2001 1:27 am  
To:  Bob Blaylock (Bob_Blaylock)   (2 of 31)  
 
  114.2 in reply to 114.1  
 
A Quick Look at the Book of Mormon 
According to Joseph Smith, the Book of Mormon is more correct than the Bible (History of the Church, Vol. 4, page 461) and contains the truths of Mormonism. However, if that is true, then why does the Book of Mormon contradict Mormon theology? 
This is because the theology of Joseph Smith didn't really start to go off the deep end until after the Book of Mormon was printed. To harmonize their changing theology with their written scripture, the Mormons gradually redefined common Christian words. That is why the definitions of Mormon words are different than those of Christianity. See Terminology Differences between Mormons and Jehovah's Witness for more information on this. 

Praying About the Book of Mormon 

One of the things Mormons ask potential converts to do is to read the Book of Mormon and then pray to God and ask Him if the Book of Mormon is true. It is said that you will then receive a testimony from the Holy Ghost that the Book of Mormon is true, that Joseph Smith is a prophet of God, and that the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is God's restored church on earth today. It is difficult to counter this testimony because it is an emotional and, I believe, spiritual phenomena. I say spiritual but I am not saying it is of God; it is of the devil. 
Mormons teach that if you are sincere and that if you ask God for wisdom as it says in James 1:5, that God will answer you and lead you into the truth. What could be more common sense than that? 
There are several reasons why this approach to determining truth is dangerous. The the most important is as follows: 
The Bible says that to determine truth you must examine the scriptures. 2 Timothy 3:16-17 says that "All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness, so that the man of God may be thoroughly equipped for every good work" (NIV). Acts 17:11 says, "Now the Bereans were of more noble character than the Thessalonians, for they received the message with great eagerness and examined the Scriptures every day to see if what Paul said was true" (NIV). If the Bereans compared what Paul the apostle said to scripture, should we do any less with Mormonism? Of course not. You don't pray about truth you look into the Bible for it. To begin with, the Mormons are going against scripture and trusting something unverifiable (except by their own subjective feelings, of which the Bible says not to trust, Jer. 17:9). 

The Book of Mormon Verses Mormon Doctrine 

The Book of Mormon does not contain Mormonism. It is more Christian than it is Mormon. Mormon theology is about many gods, god being a man, men and women potentially becoming gods, but the Book of Mormon is basically Christian in its teachings. 

The following information is in the Book of Mormon. Compare it to Mormon doctrine and see the differences. It is obvious that Mormonism grew and was pasted together as it developed. It is not internally consistent and it is self-contradictory. 




The Book of Mormon Verses Mormon Doctrine

The Book of Mormon
 Mormon Doctrine
 
There is only one God 
Mosiah 15:1,5; Alma 11:28; 2 Nephi 31:21 Mormonism teaches there are many gods. 
Joseph Smith, Journal of Discourses, Vol. 6, p. 5 
The Trinity is one God
Alma 11:44; Mosiah 15:5; 2 Nephi 31:21 The Trinity is three separate gods.
James Talmage, Articles of Faith, p. 35. 1985. 
God is unchanging
Mormon 9:9,19; Moroni 8:18; Alma 41:8; 3 Nephi 24:6 God is increasing in knowledge. 
Joseph Smith, Journal of Discourses, Vol. 6, p. 120. 
God is spirit
Alma 18:24,28; 22:9,11 God has the form of a man. 
Joseph Smith, Journal of Discourses, Vol. 6, p. 3. 
Eternal hell
Jacob 3:11; 6:10; 2 Nephi 19:16; 28:21-23. Hell is not eternal.
James Talmage, Articles of Faith, p. 55.  
Polygamy condemned
Jacob 1:15; 2:23,24,27,31;3:5; Mosiah 11:2,4; Ether 10:5,7 Polygamy was taught and practiced.
Brigham Young, Journal fo Discourses, Vol. 3, p. 266 
 
  
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  From:  Blood_Bought (RFI1965)   7/10/2001 1:30 am  
To:  Bob Blaylock (Bob_Blaylock)   (3 of 31)  
 
  114.3 in reply to 114.2  
 
12 Essential Mormon Doctrines not Found in the Book of Mormon 
If the Book of Mormon is the "most correct book of any on earth" (History of the Church, vol. 4:461), then why does it not contain essential Mormon doctrines such as... 

1. Church organization 
2. Plurality of Gods 
3. Plurality of wives doctrine 
4. Word of Wisdom 
5. God is an exalted man 
6. Celestial marriage 
7. Men may become Gods 
8. Three degrees of glory 
9. Baptism for the dead 
10. Eternal progression 
11. The Aaronic Priesthood 
12. Melchizedek Priesthood 


The founder of Mormonism said the Book of Mormon was the most correct book of any book, including the Bible (History of the Church, Vol. 4, page 461), and that a man could get closer to God by following it than any other book. Yet, essential Mormon doctrines aren't even found in it. 
This is because the Book of Mormon is nothing more than a fictional account made up by Joseph Smith. It wasn't until after the book had been printed that the additional heretical doctrines of Mormonism started to develop. That is why the Book of Mormon sounds so Christian -- at first. 

www.carm.org 
Copyright by Matthew J. Slick, 1998 




In the name of Yeshua haMashiach,
God bless you,
Russ



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  From:  Blood_Bought (RFI1965)   7/10/2001 1:31 am  
To:  Bob Blaylock (Bob_Blaylock)   (4 of 31)  
 
  114.4 in reply to 114.2  
 
Does Mormonism Attack Other Religions? 
Mormons do not like it when their Church is labeled a cult by Christians. This bothers them and they want desperately to be accepted as Christian by the Christian community. The Mormon church spends a great deal of time and money on public relations with the aim of portraying a loving, family oriented, non-condemning Christian denomination. But Christians react to this and cite the great differences in doctrine between Mormons and Christians and continue to pronounce the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints as a non-Christian cult. 
The battle continues and Mormons try to claim that they do not go around condemning other religions like "anti-Mormons" do. They say they are forgiving, tolerant, good Christian people who don't have anything against anyone. They claim they are being more Christ-like. 
Their desire for a good image is understandable. But the question remains. Does the Mormon church condemn other religious systems? The answer is definitely, "Yes." Let's look at Mormon writers and see what they have said. 

Joseph Smith said . . . 

(Regarding Joseph Smith's alleged first vision where celestial personages appeared to him.) . . .) "My object in going to inquire of the Lord was to know which of all the sects was right, that I might know which to join. No sooner, therefore, did I get possession of myself, so as to be able to speak, than I asked the personages who stood above me in the light, which of all the sects was right  and which I should join. I was answered that I must join none of them, for they were all wrong, and the personage who addressed me said that all their creeds were an abomination in His sight: that those professors were all corrupt . . ." (Joseph Smith, "History of the Church, Vol. 1, page 5-6.) 

"What is it that inspires professors of Christianity generally with a hope of salvation? It is that smooth, sophisticated influence of the devil, by which he deceives the whole world." ("Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith," Compiled by Joseph Fielding Smith, page 270.) 

(In questions directed to Joseph Smith, the founder of Mormonism. . .) 
First -- "Do you believe the Bible?" 
If we do, we are the only people under heaven that does, for there are none of the religious sects of the day that do." 
Third  "Will everybody be damned, but Mormons?" 
Yes, and a great portion of them, unless they repent, and work righteousness." (Teachings, page 119.) 

Brigham Young said. . . 

"But He did send His angel to this same obscure person, Joseph Smith jun., who afterwards became a Prophet, Seer, and Revelator, and informed him that he should not join any of the religious sects of the day, for they were all wrong." (Brigham Young, "Journal of Discourses," Vol. 2, page 171. - 1855) 

John Taylor said . . . 

"We talk about Christianity, but it is a perfect pack of nonsense....Myself and hundreds of the Elders around me have seen its pomp, parade, and glory; and what is it? It is a sounding brass and a tinkling symbol; it is as corrupt as hell; and the Devil could not invent a better engine to spread his work than the Christianity of the nineteenth century."( Journal of Discourses, Vol. 6, page 167 - 1858) 

"Where shall we look for the true order or authority of God? It cannot be found in any nation of Christendom." (J.D.", Vol. 10, page 127. - 1863) 

James Talmage said . . . 

"A self-suggesting interpretation of history indicates that there has been a great departure from the way of salvation as laid down by the Savior, a universal apostasy from the Church of Christ". ("The Articles of Faith," Deseret Book Company, Salt Lake City, Utah. P. 182.) 

Bruce McConkie said . . . 

"With the loss of the gospel, the nations of the earth went into a moral eclipse called the Dark Ages." ("Mormon Doctrine," Bookcraft, Salt Lake City, Utah, page. 44.) 

Joseph Fielding Smith said . . . 

"Again, following the death of his apostles, apostasy once more set in, and again the saving principles and ordinances of the gospel were changed to suit the conveniences and notions of the people. Doctrines were corrupted, authority lost, and a false order of religion took the place of the gospel of Jesus Christ, just as it had been the case in former dispensations, and the people were left in spiritual darkness." ("Doctrines of Salvation," page 266.) 

The Book of Mormon says. . . 

"And he said unto me: Behold there are save two churches only; the one is the church of the Lamb of God, and the other is the church of the devil; wherefore, whoso belongeth not to the church of the Lamb of God belongeth to that great church which is the mother of abominations; and she is the whore of all the earth" (1 Nephi 14:10). 

"And when the day cometh that the wrath of God is poured out upon the mother of harlots, which is the great and abominable church of all the earth, whose foundation is the devil, then, at that day, the work of the Father shall commence. . ." (1 Nephi. 14:17). 

The Doctrine and Covenants says . . . 

"Verily, verily, I say unto you, darkness covereth the earth, and gross darkness the minds of the people, and all flesh has become corrupt before my face" (Doctrine and Covenants, 112:23). 

When the Mormon missionaries come to the door and do their "gospel" presentation, they mention an apostasy and the need for a prophet, their prophet, to restore the true Teachings of Jesus. Of course, these restored' teachings are completely false. 
Nevertheless, the Mormon church clearly condemns other religious systems. Those Mormons who complain about poor treatment should familiarize themselves with their teachers' words. 

www.carm.org 
Copyright by Matthew J. Slick, 1998 

 
  
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  From:  Dr_Shock   7/10/2001 3:00 pm  
To:  Blood_Bought (RFI1965)   (5 of 31)  
 
  114.5 in reply to 114.4  
 
Can you do anything but stereotype Mormons? No. 
Can you speak for each individual Mormon as to what their personal belief system is and how much of actual Mormonism they believe? No. There are many Christian doctrines in Leviticus that I'm sure you don't believe in out of common sense. 

Can you prove that the Jesus the Mormon's follow and the Jesus you follow are different people? No. 

How about you listen to your own Bible and "Judge not lest ye be judged"... Or perhaps the Golden Rule?


-The Mad Dr. Shock
 
  
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  From:  Blood_Bought (RFI1965)   7/10/2001 3:03 pm  
To:  Dr_Shock   (6 of 31)  
 
  114.6 in reply to 114.5  
 
How 'bout you post your stupid comments to the person who wrote what is in the message I posted. 
www.carm.org 
Go to this site and email Matt Slick. He wrote what is in the post. 

Now...can I prove that the Mormon Jesus is not the Christian Jesus? 
I did already. 

Can I not judge? No...I am called to judge false teaching and lies by God as are ALL CHRISTIANS. 

As for you, get saved.



In the name of Yeshua haMashiach,
God bless you,
Russ



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Spirit-Filled Christian
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And the Holy Ghost descended in a bodily shape like a dove upon him, and a voice came from heaven, which said, Thou art my beloved Son; in thee I am well pleased.
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  From:  Dr_Shock   7/10/2001 7:01 pm  
To:  Blood_Bought (RFI1965)   (7 of 31)  
 
  114.7 in reply to 114.6  
 
<<<How 'bout you post your stupid comments to the person who wrote what is in the message I posted.>>> 
Once again a Christian talking down to a Non Christian, confirming every stereotype the Non Christian world has against you. How defensive you get when I state a few, simple facts and try to point out your own moral errors. If you can't take the heat, get out of the kitchen. 

<<<Go to this site and email Matt Slick. He wrote what is in the post.>>> 

You Christians say that only a Christian can know Christianity. As none of the people from your for-profit web page (they're sure sell a lot of stuff) were ever Mormon, so perhaps the Mormons could say the same about you. Ever think about that? 

<<<Now...can I prove that the Mormon Jesus is not the Christian Jesus? I did already.>>> 

Jesus died on the cross for our sins. Both Christians and Mormons believe this; That Jesus was the savior, which is the basis for all modern Christian doctrine. Jesus was "the Christ", hence why all who follow his teachings are called Christians. Therefore, Mormons are Christians although they go about it in a much different way than most. 

<<<Can I not judge? No...I am called to judge false teaching and lies by God as are ALL CHRISTIANS.>>> 

Your own Bible says that only God can pass judgment. I believe the same argument you used above was used to begin both the Crusades and the Inquisition. 

<<<As for you, get saved.>>> 

Perhaps you should reread your Bible since I, a Non Christian, apparently know more of its contents and moral teachings than you do. 



-The Mad Dr. Shock
 
  
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  From:  Al Kupone (Kupone)   7/10/2001 7:07 pm  
To:  Blood_Bought (RFI1965)   (8 of 31)  
 
  114.8 in reply to 114.6  
 
How 'bout you post your ---- comments to the person who wrote what is in the message I posted. 
www.carm.org 
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= 

So... what you're saying is that you take your information from other people and plajurize it as your own work? That's theft! Yet the second you got criticism you passed the buck... nice job! 

Al Kupone 



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Edited 7/10/01 11:08:04 PM ET by DAVIDABROWN 
  
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  From:  Blood_Bought (RFI1965)   7/10/2001 7:22 pm  
To:  Dr_Shock   (9 of 31)  
 
  114.9 in reply to 114.7  
 
Like I said, get saved. 
It is clear your own ignorance has run rampant across your keyboard and by doing so, has shown your lack of knowledge concerning Christianity, the bible, Jesus and things therein. 
I would sit here and show you where you are wrong but I don't have the time to cast pearls before swine and if I did, I would be doing my Lord a disservice.... 

I stand by what I said.



In the name of Yeshua haMashiach,
God bless you,
Russ



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


 

 The
Spirit-Filled Christian
Forum  
Vsit My Family Website 
 
 

And the Holy Ghost descended in a bodily shape like a dove upon him, and a voice came from heaven, which said, Thou art my beloved Son; in thee I am well pleased.
Luke 3:22
 Vsit My MINISTRY Website 
 
 

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  From:  Blood_Bought (RFI1965)   7/10/2001 7:23 pm  
To:  Al Kupone (Kupone)   (10 of 31)  
 
  114.10 in reply to 114.8  
 
<SIGH> 
Go to the site, read the copyright notice, then, post your pathetic attempt at an apology. 
Do you even know what Plagiarism is?

Apparently not so, let me post the definition for you...

plagiarize \"pla-je-'riz\ vb -rized; -rizing : 
to present the ideas or words of another as one's own.
Thanks for the false accusation.... 



In the name of Yeshua haMashiach,
God bless you,
Russ



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


 

 The
Spirit-Filled Christian
Forum  
Vsit My Family Website 
 
 

And the Holy Ghost descended in a bodily shape like a dove upon him, and a voice came from heaven, which said, Thou art my beloved Son; in thee I am well pleased.
Luke 3:22
 Vsit My MINISTRY Website 
 
 

  Watch this space for current promotions.
  



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Edited 7/10/01 10:26:42 PM ET by RFI1965 
  
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  From:  Dr_Shock   7/10/2001 7:44 pm  
To:  Blood_Bought (RFI1965)   (11 of 31)  
 
  114.11 in reply to 114.9  
 
<<<It is clear your own ignorance has run rampant across your keyboard and by doing so, has shown your lack of knowledge concerning Christianity, the bible, Jesus and things therein.>>> 
I am not the one who cannot capitalize the word "Bible". Nor am I the one who doesn't know the contents of Bible. Vengeance is not yours. The Bible itself says that vengeance and judgment only belong to God himself. 

<<<I would sit here and show you where you are wrong but I don't have the time to cast pearls before swine and if I did, I would be doing my Lord a disservice....>>> 

Once again with the name-calling. The only reason you don't show me my error is because you know I'm right and the Bible supports me (Read all of Romans 12 to see what I mean). A true Christian would defend his argument with scripture because his argument would be based in the Bible (See David, Rachelschild, etc for example). Knowing God from a Christian standpoint does not automatically make one well versed in the Bible, nor does knowing the Bible make one Christian. 



-The Mad Dr. Shock
 
  
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  From:  Blood_Bought (RFI1965)   7/10/2001 7:55 pm  
To:  Dr_Shock   (12 of 31)  
 
  114.12 in reply to 114.11  
 
See if your puny little mind can wrap itself around this: 
Judge not according to the appearance, but judge righteous judgment. 
John 7:24 

For what have I to do to judge them also that are without? do not ye judge them that are within? But them that are without God judgeth. Therefore put away from among yourselves that wicked person. 
1 Cor. 5:12-13 

Do you need these verses explained to you? 





In the name of Yeshua haMashiach,
God bless you,
Russ



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


 

 The
Spirit-Filled Christian
Forum  
Vsit My Family Website 
 
 

And the Holy Ghost descended in a bodily shape like a dove upon him, and a voice came from heaven, which said, Thou art my beloved Son; in thee I am well pleased.
Luke 3:22
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  From:  Dr_Shock   7/10/2001 10:49 pm  
To:  Blood_Bought (RFI1965)   (13 of 31)  
 
  114.13 in reply to 114.12  
 
<<<See if your puny little mind can wrap itself around this:>>> 
I won't drop to your pitiful level of mud slinging (as its the only leg you have left to stand on). You keep getting angrier and angrier and, according to Romans 2, that means I'm winning.... Or didn't you bother to read Romans 2? 

<<<Judge not according to the appearance, but judge righteous judgment. John 7:24>>> 

Please take the quote into context. This is Jesus' response to the Jews calling him demon possessed for raising the dead. And please... Quote the Bible correctly. The real quote from the Oxford King James Study Bible is, "Judge not by appearances, but judge with right judgment." In other words, Jesus was asking them if they really though he was all that bad for healing the sick and raising the dead. To make this simple for you, allow me to paraphrase: Don't judge by what you see and hear, judge by the goodness of ones actions. 

<<<For what have I to do to judge them also that are without? do not ye judge them that are within? But them that are without God judgeth. Therefore put away from among yourselves that wicked person. 1 Cor. 5:12-13>>> 

*Sigh* 
Once again, you failed to take the quote into context. All of I Cor. 5 is to judge the immoral. Once again, though, you got the quote wrong. The actual quote it, "For what have I to do with judging outsiders? Is it not those inside the Church who whom you should judge? God judges those outside 'Drive out the wicked person from among you." (I Cor. 5:12-13) 

Once again to paraphrase (since you don't seem to get it): Christians should censor themselves for immorality. 

<<<Do you need these verses explained to you?>>> 

No, I believe I explained them to you quite adequately since you didn't appear to know what they mean. Whatever Bible you appear to be using seems to get a lot wrong. I'm using the Oxford Annotated Bible (King James version).This is the Bible they give priests in seminary school, by the way. 

I do so love how your large, ---- HTMLed signature betrays your words. *Wink* 



-The Mad Dr. Shock
 



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Edited 7/11/01 1:54:25 AM ET by DAVIDABROWN 
  
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  From:  Blood_Bought (RFI1965)   7/10/2001 10:52 pm  
To:  Dr_Shock   (14 of 31)  
 
  114.14 in reply to 114.13  
 
For a non Christian you sure do think you have an understanding of scripture....too bad it is completely incorrect. 
I am not angry at you at all. I simply find your style offensive.



In the name of Yeshua haMashiach,
God bless you,
Russ

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


 

 The
Spirit-Filled Christian
Forum  
Vsit My Family Website 
 
 

And the Holy Ghost descended in a bodily shape like a dove upon him, and a voice came from heaven, which said, Thou art my beloved Son; in thee I am well pleased.
Luke 3:22
 Vsit My MINISTRY Website 
 
 

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  From:  Dr_Shock   7/10/2001 10:55 pm  
To:  Blood_Bought (RFI1965)   (15 of 31)  
 
  114.15 in reply to 114.14  
 
<<<For a non Christian you sure do think you have an understanding of scripture....too bad it is completely incorrect. I am not angry at you at all. I simply find your style offensive.>>> 
And either of the above are justifications for name-calling? I alrady publically pointed out that you can't even quote the Bible correctly nor can you take its words into correct context. (BTW, I used to be Christian.) Give it up.


-The Mad Dr. Shock
 
  
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  From:  Blood_Bought (RFI1965)   7/10/2001 10:58 pm  
To:  Dr_Shock   (16 of 31)  
 
  114.16 in reply to 114.15  
 
Used to be? 
That explains a lot. My issue with you is the fact that you feel the need to offend Christians just because they still believe in a way of life that was too hard for you. 
Your assessment of my understanding of scripture is moot. Why? You're wrong. When you come to understand that Christians ARE to judge one another based on several things as outline by God, you will see how terribly wrong you are. 

For now, this discussion is going around in circles. If you have nothing interesting to add, then cease to post to me.



In the name of Yeshua haMashiach,
God bless you,
Russ



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 The
Spirit-Filled Christian
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Vsit My Family Website 
 
 

And the Holy Ghost descended in a bodily shape like a dove upon him, and a voice came from heaven, which said, Thou art my beloved Son; in thee I am well pleased.
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 Vsit My MINISTRY Website 
 
 

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  From:  Al Kupone (Kupone)   7/10/2001 11:01 pm  
To:  Blood_Bought (RFI1965)   (17 of 31)  
 
  114.17 in reply to 114.12  
 
<<See if your puny little mind can wrap itself around this:>> 
Well, I was going to appoligze for having shown I'm capable of making human mistakes... but wow! You started up the mud slinging in an attempt to cushion your little... ego. 

May I suggest these passages for you to meditate upon? 

The Books of Proverbs, chapter 14 

17: A man of quick temper acts foolishly, but a man of discretion is patient. 

29: He who is slow to anger has great understanding, but he who has a hasty temper exalts folly. 

Chapter 15, 18: A hot-tempered man stirs up strife, but he who is slow to anger quiets contention. 

4 Maccabees (Apocrypha), chapter 2 
16: For the temperate mind repels all these malicious emotions, just as it repels anger -- for it is sovereign over even this. 

Titus, chapter 2 
2: Bid the older men be temperate, serious, sensible, sound in faith, in love, and in steadfastness. 

Luke, chapter 6 
To him who strikes you on the cheek, offer the other also; and from him who takes away your coat do not withhold even your shirt. 
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- 

The King James Bible, by the way, is younger and is more popular because it is more accessable. By the way, I do have a copy of the greek NT, Latin NT and the hebrew OT. It's a vrey nice reference book. 

Al Kupone
 
  
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  From:  Dr_Shock   7/10/2001 11:07 pm  
To:  Blood_Bought (RFI1965)   (18 of 31)  
 
  114.18 in reply to 114.16  
 
If you think you're going to get the last word, you're wrong. =) 
<<<Used to be? 
That explains a lot. My issue with you is the fact that you feel the need to offend Christians just because they still believe in a way of life that was too hard for you.>>> 

Riiiiiiiiiiight... Too hard. The life I live now is harder because now I'm doing 20 hours of volunteer work a week at a local church (for drug rehab people who aren't Christian) which I believe is a more morally correct thing for me to do then preach hate because I think I'm the only right person in the universe. 

<<<Your assessment of my understanding of scripture is moot. Why? You're wrong. When you come to understand that Christians ARE to judge one another based on several things as outline by God, you will see how terribly wrong you are.>>> 

I'm wrong yet you cannot correct me... Ironic. None of the rest of what you said makes sense because you don't consider Mormons to be Christian. Do you even know what the word "moot" means? You used that out of context, too. 

<<<For now, this discussion is going around in circles. If you have nothing interesting to add, then cease to post to me.>>> 

I believe I just did. I had to defend myself since you, once again, made a personal attack against me without even meeting me or knowing anything about me. 



-The Mad Dr. Shock
 
  
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  From:  Blood_Bought (RFI1965)   7/10/2001 11:08 pm  
To:  Al Kupone (Kupone)   (19 of 31)  
 
  114.19 in reply to 114.17  
 
Does this mean you're NOT sorry for falsely accusing me of plagiarism?



In the name of Yeshua haMashiach,
God bless you,
Russ

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   From:  Al Kupone (Kupone)   7/10/2001 11:11 pm  
To:  Blood_Bought (RFI1965)   (20 of 31)  
 
  114.20 in reply to 114.19  
 
No, it means quite simply I will withhold an appology until such time as you appologize for slinging mud in such a rude manner. 
Al Kupone
 
  
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From:  Blood_Bought (RFI1965)   7/10/2001 11:11 pm  
To:  Dr_Shock   (21 of 31)  
 
  114.21 in reply to 114.18  
 
Mormons are not Christian but not because *I* say so....it is because the bible, which, by the way, is not a proper noun and does NOT get capitalized, says so. 
bible \"bi-bel\ n [ME, fr. OF, fr. ML biblia, fr. Gk, pl. of biblion book, fr. byblos papyrus, book, fr. Byblos, ancient Phoenician city from which papyrus was exported] 1 cap : the sacred scriptures of Christians comprising the Old and New Testaments 2 cap : the sacred scriptures of Judaism; also : those of some other religion 3 : a publication that is considered authoritative for its subject  biblical \"bi-bli-kel\ adj 




In the name of Yeshua haMashiach,
God bless you,
Russ



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Spirit-Filled Christian
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Vsit My Family Website 
 
 

And the Holy Ghost descended in a bodily shape like a dove upon him, and a voice came from heaven, which said, Thou art my beloved Son; in thee I am well pleased.
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  From:  Blood_Bought (RFI1965)   7/10/2001 11:12 pm  
To:  Al Kupone (Kupone)   (22 of 31)  
 
  114.22 in reply to 114.20  
 
So, if I understand you right, you will not repent of your sin against me until I repent of mine to you? 
Hmmmm...let me get back to you.



In the name of Yeshua haMashiach,
God bless you,
Russ



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Spirit-Filled Christian
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And the Holy Ghost descended in a bodily shape like a dove upon him, and a voice came from heaven, which said, Thou art my beloved Son; in thee I am well pleased.
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  From:  Dr_Shock   7/10/2001 11:18 pm  
To:  Blood_Bought (RFI1965)   (23 of 31)  
 
  114.23 in reply to 114.21  
 
Bible is a proper noun when referring to _The_ Bible (which I think we are) just as you would the title of any book. First, last and all important words in a title are capitalized. Just like how the word "god" is lowercase when referring to the concept and capitalized when referring to the higher being. Please see the Scott Forsman Handbook for Writers if you don't believe me. The word "bible" itself only means "book".


-The Mad Dr. Shock 
  
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  From:  Blood_Bought (RFI1965)   7/10/2001 11:21 pm  
To:  Dr_Shock   (24 of 31)  
 
  114.24 in reply to 114.23  
 
When I refer to the bible, I refer to The Holy Bible or The Holy Scriptures. A bible can be any collection of so called scriptures. Take a look at the apocrypha or the NWT or the Book of Mormon! These are considered by some of these people as a bible. So....you were saying?



In the name of Yeshua haMashiach,
God bless you,
Russ

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Spirit-Filled Christian
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And the Holy Ghost descended in a bodily shape like a dove upon him, and a voice came from heaven, which said, Thou art my beloved Son; in thee I am well pleased.
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  From:  Dr_Shock   7/10/2001 11:26 pm  
To:  Blood_Bought (RFI1965)   (25 of 31)  
 
  114.25 in reply to 114.24  
 
As I said, all the word Bible means is "book". No matter what, any book-type-thingie called "Bible", or any book title with "Bible" in it is going to have the word "Bible" capitalized in it according to the rules of Western grammar. It doesn't matter what it is, Book of Mormon is capitalized the same as are Shakespeare plays as are every other text ever bound.


-The Mad Dr. Shock 
  
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  From:  Blood_Bought (RFI1965)   7/10/2001 11:28 pm  
To:  Dr_Shock   (26 of 31)  
 
  114.26 in reply to 114.25  
 
When I refer to the bible, do you know what bible I am referring to? According to Webster's, it is NOT a proper noun. I will go by what my brother says, if that's alright with you.



In the name of Yeshua haMashiach,
God bless you,
Russ

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 The
Spirit-Filled Christian
Forum  
Vsit My Family Website 
 
 

And the Holy Ghost descended in a bodily shape like a dove upon him, and a voice came from heaven, which said, Thou art my beloved Son; in thee I am well pleased.
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  From:  Al Kupone (Kupone)   7/10/2001 11:28 pm  
To:  Blood_Bought (RFI1965)   (27 of 31)  
 
  114.27 in reply to 114.22  
 
So, if I understand you right, you will not repent of your sin against me until I repent of mine to you? 
-==-=-=-=-=-=--= 

What Sin against me? You've acted immaturely, I've already admitted I made a mistake, I'm still within rights to hold an appology due to your acting in an uncivil manner to others upon the board since you don't like losing an argument and enjoy saying things that are bent towards psychological damage. 

Al Kupone
 
  
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  From:  Blood_Bought (RFI1965)   7/10/2001 11:34 pm  
To:  Al Kupone (Kupone)   (28 of 31)  
 
  114.28 in reply to 114.27  
 
Psychological damage? 
Riiiiiight. 
I'm sorry to have your "feelings."



In the name of Yeshua haMashiach,
God bless you,
Russ



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 The
Spirit-Filled Christian
Forum  
Vsit My Family Website 
 
 

And the Holy Ghost descended in a bodily shape like a dove upon him, and a voice came from heaven, which said, Thou art my beloved Son; in thee I am well pleased.
Luke 3:22
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  From:  Al Kupone (Kupone)   7/11/2001 12:02 am  
To:  Blood_Bought (RFI1965)   (29 of 31)  
 
  114.29 in reply to 114.28  
 
Psychological damage? 
Riiiiiight. 
I'm sorry to have your "feelings." 

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= 

It is not the mud slinging towards me that I object to, I'm a big man and can take it. That doesn't mean I have to enjoy watching it slung at others. While I enjoy debating with those here on this board, I do not enjoy watching it progress to that of childish mud slinging such as the quip that levels down to 'I'm right because I say and you're wrong because I say.' that was made when you said, "See if your puny little mind can wrap itself around this:" To Dr_Shock, Going up against Bob Baylock was annoying but the majority of the 'Christians' on this board see mormanism as nothing but something to jump on and flame. Even being against those out here who are Jewish or someother non christian group that are not even close. 

You owe an apology number of people on this board, but don't worry, I don't want one from you, I don't need to hear an apology to know that someone is chosing to be self-rightious and rude because they can't handle a real debate. 

The Christianity I have seen here and when I grew up can be lead in three examples, perhaps you should think about which type you really are. The first type says thier opinion, throws the bible around to excuse them from being able to do any wrong and are generally obnoxious about it, some of them even do things such as discriminate against other Christian or Jew just because of thier religious and interreligious group. The other type knows the bible, and uses thier acts to convert and try to be true Christians, the kind who will help in a hospice for gay men dieing of HIV even though they are straight and don't believe gays are right but still offers them kindness for the pain they are in. The third type is a Christian in word. They do or say the required things and beg for forgiveness... every time they can crawl out of bed for worship and beg for forgiveness for that day then go out and do thier sins all over again and think nothing Christian related in thier head. 

The latter is the only I have not seen that says to be Christian on this board. 

-Those with tunnel vision often miss the exit.- 

Al Kupone 

Al Kupone
 
  
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  From:  Blood_Bought (RFI1965)   7/11/2001 12:10 am  
To:  Al Kupone (Kupone)   (30 of 31)  
 
  114.30 in reply to 114.29  
 
First of all, Jews are closer to the truth than Mormons... 
Next, you seem to be the only one complaining.



In the name of Yeshua haMashiach,
God bless you,
Russ



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Spirit-Filled Christian
Forum  
Vsit My Family Website 
 
 

And the Holy Ghost descended in a bodily shape like a dove upon him, and a voice came from heaven, which said, Thou art my beloved Son; in thee I am well pleased.
Luke 3:22
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   From:  David (DavidABrown)    7/11/2001 12:13 am  
To:  Al Kupone (Kupone)   (31 of 31)  
 
  114.31 in reply to 114.29  
 
This is Not an Anti-Jewish forum. 
I have not seen any Anti-Jewish remarks on this forum. If you know of any please point them out. 

The Mormon issue is a different issue, as Mormons Claim to be the Only and True Christians, Obviously a claim Not supported by this forum. 

Christians have every Right and Obligation to Define and Present Christianity to the world! And to present what is non-Christian i.e. Mormonism. 






David A. Brown
Basic Christian: Forum
 
  
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